“It's fine when you're swinging big to have a few misses in a controlled environment” - 𝗝𝗼𝗻𝗻𝘆 𝗠𝗼𝗼𝗱, 𝗗𝗶𝗿𝗲𝗰𝘁𝗼𝗿 𝗼𝗳 𝘁𝗵𝗲 𝗡𝗮𝘁𝗶𝗼𝗻𝗮𝗹 𝗔𝘂𝗱𝗶𝘁 𝗢𝗳𝗳𝗶𝗰𝗲 making it very clear that it’s fine for public sector organisations to try things and fail.

In today’s episode, I talk to Jonny about what value for money really means, why BCR is often misused and how the NAO supports innovation in the public sector.

The conversation about BCRs is also fascinating: highlighting that value-for-money rules don’t require complex decisions to be boiled down to a single number.

Do take a listen to this one!

Olly Glover went from rail consultant to MP in a political whirlwind. We talk innovation in legacy sectors, the chaos of becoming an MP overnight and the culture of Westminster.

Plus: why UK transport policy feels stuck, and how we could actually fix electrification

I spoke to Lars Strömgren, Stockholm’s Vice Mayor for Transport and Urban Environment, about the city’s journey from car-centricity to a cycling-friendly capital.

We talked about his childhood on the back of his grandmother’s bike, the cultural shifts that made cycling mainstream and the urban planning philosophy that underpins Stockholm’s transformation - including how storytelling, kid-focused design and even building with wood all fit into a sustainable transport vision.

My guest this week is Anjali Devadasan, founder of Treeva, a startup generating energy from passing vehicles and trains. Her turbines harness airflow to power local infrastructure like lighting and EV chargers.

We talked about the technology, the challenges of scaling, and her personal drive to tackle climate change, inspired by her family’s personal experience of climate-change induced flash floods.

Anjali also shared great advice for founders around protecting time for strategy, running real world experiments and building around purpose.

A truly inspirational conversation with someone who’s achieved incredible things very early in her career.

In Oslo, Christian Willoch and his team at Ruter are using autonomous vehicles to strengthen public transport – not compete with it.

I visit their pilot project, where real passengers are already riding Ruter-branded autonomous vehicles in an outer suburb, and we talk about why public service, not robotaxis, is the future.

I also take a ride – and you can listen in as I give a live commentary from the back seat.

Stephen Bush, Associate Editor at the Financial Times, is one of the few political journalists who truly gets transport policy.

In this episode, we talk about why transport matters far more to economic productivity than politicians realise, why ambition in major infrastructure projects has declined since the financial crisis and why simply nationalising services won't fix public transport.

Stephen also shares insights on why London’s success is the exception not the rule (and how its future success is not guaranteed) and we discuss whether a mayor of a major British city (Greater Manchester, for example) could become Prime Minister.

Elke Van den Brandt has transformed Brussels' streets – and taken a political battering for doing so.

As the city’s mobility minister, she’s championed slower speeds, safer roads and public spaces that feel more like “living rooms than corridors”.

We talk about her 30km/h city-wide limit, the backlash it sparked, the silent majority that supports it and the power of empathy, small projects and showing up in person.

It was a superb insight into how political bravery, behavioural science and empathy (backed up by strong leadership) can work together to reshape cities for the better.

A taster of what’s coming up in Season Four

Tom Nutley joins me to unpack the challenges and missed opportunities in micromobility.

From transport dead spots to Silicon Valley hype, we explore how cities and operators can deliver real public good through better integration, infrastructure and sustainable models. Tom doesn’t hold back!

How does Britain’s knowledge economy shape its cities? Paul Swinney from the Centre for Cities joins me to explore the North-South divide, the role of transport in economic growth and why second-tier cities underperform.

We discuss what agglomeration means and why it matters, how post-pandemic work trends are reshaping transport needs and why investing in urban connectivity is key to unlocking Britain’s economic potential.

Lee Waters did something unfashionable in modern politics: he led.

As both 𝗠𝗶𝗻𝗶𝘀𝘁𝗲𝗿 𝗳𝗼𝗿 𝗧𝗿𝗮𝗻𝘀𝗽𝗼𝗿𝘁 𝗮𝗻𝗱 𝗠𝗶𝗻𝗶𝘀𝘁𝗲𝗿 𝗳𝗼𝗿 𝗖𝗹𝗶𝗺𝗮𝘁𝗲 𝗖𝗵𝗮𝗻𝗴𝗲 𝗶𝗻 𝗪𝗮𝗹𝗲𝘀, he curtailed road-building, introduced a national 20mph speed limit and set in motion reforms to create an integrated, publicly owned transport network.

This episode is a masterclass in the reality of political change: why transport is so often overlooked, how to challenge decades of car-first orthodoxy and why evidence-based policy isn’t enough without political courage.

Frank Elter may be a part-time Professor, but he’s a very real-world professor.

As 𝗖𝗵𝗶𝗲𝗳 𝗦𝗰𝗶𝗲𝗻𝘁𝗶𝘀𝘁 𝗮𝗻𝗱 𝗩𝗶𝗰𝗲 𝗣𝗿𝗲𝘀𝗶𝗱𝗲𝗻𝘁 𝗮𝘁 𝗧𝗲𝗹𝗲𝗻𝗼𝗿 𝗥𝗲𝘀𝗲𝗮𝗿𝗰𝗵, he’s responsible for innovation and planning for one of Norway’s telecoms giants.

He has thought deeply about how corporations can stay innovative. He’s thought about it concerning his work, and he’s researched at his university. He’s even written a book.

On this edition of The Freewheeling Podcast we talk about how modularity can help organisations be “ambidextrous” (i.e. able to focus on operations and innovation), and the fact that every approach creates new problems to solve.

He also tells a pretty remarkable story about how Telenor started its most innovative project to date!

The UK public sector spends somewhere between £300 billion and a trillion. A lot of that goes through public procurement processes.

That creates enormous innovation potential.

Yet, being honest, the words “public sector procurement” aren’t seen as synonyms for innovation.

This week, the new Procurement Act 2023 comes into force, so it seems a good time to stop and look at why public sector procurement is a challenge and what can be done about it.

My guest is a former colleague. I knew Rikesh Shah when he was a colleague as Head of Open Innovation at Transport for London, but now he 𝗵𝗲𝗮𝗱𝘀 𝘁𝗵𝗲 𝗚𝗼𝘃𝗲𝗿𝗻𝗺𝗲𝗻𝘁’𝘀 𝗜𝗻𝗻𝗼𝘃𝗮𝘁𝗶𝗼𝗻 𝗣𝗿𝗼𝗰𝘂𝗿𝗲𝗺𝗲𝗻𝘁 𝗘𝗺𝗽𝗼𝘄𝗲𝗿𝗺𝗲𝗻𝘁 𝗖𝗲𝗻𝘁𝗿𝗲.

In this conversation, we discuss how cultural barriers, such as fear of failure, hinder innovation in procurement and the barriers startups face in selling to the public sector.

Why don’t we build homes people wish to live in? Terraced streets are popular and sustainable and support shops, services and transport, so why do we keep building low-density, car-dependent suburbs? And what needs to be done to create a nationwide tram renaissance?

These are just some of the questions I get into in discussion with David Milner, the 𝗠𝗗 𝗼𝗳 𝗖𝗿𝗲𝗮𝘁𝗲 𝗦𝘁𝗿𝗲𝗲𝘁𝘀.

Create Streets is a curious outfit: officially, it’s a design consultancy. But it has a policy and lobbying arm, and is highly influential with the current Government. Not bad for just 10 people…

If, like me, you would love to see some big changes in how we design and build towns, this is an episode you’ll enjoy.

Everyone agrees we need more sustainable transport but no-one has enough money to pay for it.

Could ‘land value capture’ be the answer? This is the approach where by transport lines are funded through the increases in the land value that the stations stimulate.

Well, George Hazel thinks so. In fact, he knows so, because he developed the land value capture method used for the recently-reopened Northumberland line.

In today’s episode he tells me how it works; but only after a fascinating discussion on the “Seven Deadly Wins” for making a city succeed.

Jarrett Walker has been designing bus networks for thirty years. From his consulting practice in Portland, Oregon, he’s built a specialism in helping cash-strapped local authorities optimise their networks through his business Jarrett Walker Associates.

And you can’t optimise if you don’t know what public transport is actually for and how you’re measuring whether or not it’s achieving those goals.

Eventually he’d done so much thinking on this topic that he wrote it all down in his book Human Transit.

In our conversation, he talks me through why it’s important to understand whether a transport network is seeking to optimise for coverage or patronage and how ‘access analysis’ can provide everyone with their own personal measure of public transport freedom.

Birmingham was the first city I lived in as a proper ‘grown-up’ and it was metamorphosing before my eyes.

Previously famous as Britain’s ‘car city’, it ripped up its inner ring road the year I arrived.

Today, the city centre is unrecognisable: spacious, walkable and with a brand new tram route snaking past brand new buildings.

Anne Shaw has been involved in this transformation since she first moved to Birmingham in 1991 to take up a job as a drainage engineer.

Today she’s 𝗘𝘅𝗲𝗰𝘂𝘁𝗶𝘃𝗲 𝗗𝗶𝗿𝗲𝗰𝘁𝗼𝗿 𝗼𝗳 𝗧𝗿𝗮𝗻𝘀𝗽𝗼𝗿𝘁 𝗳𝗼𝗿 𝘁𝗵𝗲 𝗪𝗲𝘀𝘁 𝗠𝗶𝗱𝗹𝗮𝗻𝗱𝘀, and she tells me just how this extraordinary change has been achieved.

Politics tends to focus on what is to be done, but none of it matters if it doesn't actually happen.

We've been living through a crisis of governance recently. Government has become centralised, micro-managing and subject to constant, wild oscillations of policy.

Is this as good as it gets? The 𝗙𝘂𝘁𝘂𝗿𝗲 𝗚𝗼𝘃𝗲𝗿𝗻𝗮𝗻𝗰𝗲 𝗙𝗼𝗿𝘂𝗺 was set up to make sure it isn't.

Grace Wyld is Head of Policy and Programmes and she joins me to talk about Missions, Devolution and how good Government needs to mean a transformation in how Government works.

Karen Vancluysen has an infectious passion for sustainable transport and urban mobility. As 𝗦𝗲𝗰𝗿𝗲𝘁𝗮𝗿𝘆 𝗚𝗲𝗻𝗲𝗿𝗮𝗹 𝗼𝗳 𝗣𝗢𝗟𝗜𝗦, she runs a network of over 100 European cities and regions, all innovating to accelerate the transition to more sustainable mobility.

In today’s episode, we chat about the places that are leading the charge, and the challenges of the growth of populism. She gives advice to political leaders aspiring to make change happen and is inspirational on what has been done - and what more needs to happen.

We end with her recommended mobility ‘grand tour’ of Europe, to see what’s already been achieved on the ground.

It’s a great start to Season 3!

Welcome back to The Freewheeling Podcast, everyone.

Maria Hofberg’s rail company doesn’t just have satisfied customers: it has the most satisfied customers in Sweden. Not just the most satisfied rail customers: the most satisfied customers of any transport firm in the Swedish Quality Index, beating buses, airlines and ferry firms.

The company in question is 𝗩𝗥 𝗦𝗻𝗮𝗯𝗯𝘁å𝗴 𝗮𝗻𝗱 𝗠𝗮𝗿𝗶𝗮 𝗶𝘀 𝗖𝗵𝗶𝗲𝗳 𝗖𝗼𝗺𝗺𝗲𝗿𝗰𝗶𝗮𝗹 𝗢𝗳𝗳𝗶𝗰𝗲𝗿.